How to get a career in the arts | with the National Theatre

Participants

• Emily Slade - podcast producer and host, Prospects
• Simon Stephens - head of skills centre, National Theatre
• Jade Boycott - scenic art apprentice
• Lily Cleaver - scenic art apprentice

Transcript

Emily Slade: Hello and welcome back to Future You, the podcast brought to you by graduate careers experts, Prospects. I'm your host, Emily Slade, and in this episode I go behind the scenes at the National Theatre to discuss the opportunities available for people looking to pursue jobs in the arts. I start by talking to Jade and Lily, who are both currently doing the Scenic Art Apprenticeship, and then chat to Simon Stevens, head of the National Theatre Skills Centre, about the various opportunities they offer and how you can find them.

Lily Cleaver: My name is Lily and I'm a Scenic Art Apprentice at the National Theatre.

Jade Boycott: Hi, I'm Jade and I'm the Scenic Artist Apprentice at the National Theatre.

Emily Slade: So can you explain what you're currently doing? What is the Scenic Art Apprenticeship?

Jade Boycott: So we're currently on a two-year course and we split our time between the National Theatre and RADA. So at the National we do mainly show stuff, helping out with like the bigger groups and obviously shows. And then we go over to RADA every few months and we do our own individual projects for our portfolio at the end.

Emily Slade: That's cool. So when you say individual projects, is that something that you can literally create from the ground up?

Lily Cleaver: So part of the apprenticeship is like Creative Alliance. So we're also with Creative Alliance, which is like an apprenticeship provider. And they like, part of like apprenticeship is like, KSBs and that's like knowledge, skills, behaviours, that kind of thing. You have to tick them off to finish the apprenticeship, basically. So it's a Level 3. So that's what we do at RADA. So we've done like a spray painting project and then we're doing polycarving. So we learn those skills, but they're like our own personal projects to do, basically. It's just kind of like to practice the skill of the thing that we're doing. So like we've never used a spray gun before, so we learn how to use a spray gun, like how to clean it properly. You have to clean them really, really well so they don't get broken and they're really expensive as well. So then we just kind of like pick, pick like what we wanted to paint. So I picked, it was a really random thing. It was like a window and there was like condensation and like a smiley face drawn out of it. And then Jade literally picked like a person underwater so you could kind of.

Jade Boycott: Yeah, it was basically whatever you wanted it to be.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, it was nice to like, and it was good. And then the other apprentice as well done like a gorilla and leaves and all that kind of thing. So it was nice to see like what you could get and the range you could get.

Emily Slade: Yeah, that's so cool. So how did you hear about the apprenticeship?

Lily Cleaver: Well, honestly, through like the mailing lists that they do. Yeah, it was safe for me. Yeah, they usually like send emails. I also done a course, or like I'm a member with the National Youth Theatre because I've done a course of them. So they sent out like emails and stuff of like job opportunities. So I heard from them and then just from the National Theatre, honestly. And I was like, that looks cool. What was the application process like? So it started out an online application and it was like a mini portfolio, wasn't it? Yeah.

Jade Boycott: Just some examples of basically anything creative you had done. If you were like, Lily had done her stage management, so that was obviously a really good thing to put in. And I'd done like some show stuff at school. So literally anything I could think of, I just put that in it.

Lily Cleaver: Like literally I made like some like back in A level drama. I made some like fake cigarette prop. I literally put that in there. I was like, I'm going to just like showing that she was so variety as well. Like you can do, like just showing that you're passionate about that kind of thing. You're like constantly creating stuff. It didn't really matter what it was. I just wanted to see.

Jade Boycott: Yeah. And then when we got through that, it was really good. They offered us to do, if you got through to the second stage, this was the interview here. You could do a, was it the Theatreworks?

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, they have like a Theatreworks It's like to prep for interviews and I think they do it for companies and stuff, but they gave us the opportunity to do it before the interview, the Friday before the Monday. And they said it was like completely optional. So I think about 30 people got, was it about 30 people got through for their interviews, but only about 10 people went to the Theatreworks thing on the Friday. And they said it was like optional and it like didn't impact, but we both went and it definitely helped.

Jade Boycott: Yeah. I think with the nerves as well, because it's such a big building. You think, God, where do I go? But that gave you like the lay of the land. And like Lily wasn't at my interview, but there was a few other girls that came to that interview Monday. So it was just a familiar face that you could talk to. And then, yeah, so we had our interviews on the Monday, which was, It was a bit like speed date. You went, it was like the scenic artist group and a few other people and they all had different questions.

Lily Cleaver: You had like 6 minutes each, didn't you? Yeah. Which was quite, it sounded like really intense and I was like really nervous for it. But we both found once we were kind of like in that situation, we were like buzzing. We were like, yeah, next person, next person.

Jade Boycott: It was over and you're like, oh God, I want to open this.

Lily Cleaver: But it was quite nice the way they've done it because usually if you go to an interview and you speak to someone like, You feel like you might leave and you don't get enough said or you don't get to show like a painting that you've done that really like was good for the job or something. It was nice that you could like repeat yourself or like say something you'd missed and that kind of thing. And then they looked, one of them looked at our portfolio and like looked through what we've done.

Jade Boycott: We'll say if they ever say bring one piece, always bring one piece. They want to look at more. They always want to see more. So just bring the one piece you're really proud of and have some extra ones as well.

Lily Cleaver: But and then it like so then they. How many people was it? Ten people? Then it was like minimised down to.

Jade Boycott: Regrouped.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah. And it was for, and then so the second round was like a skills, did they call it a skills test? Yes. And then you went for like the whole day and had to, which was quite intense. Although that was actually quite enjoyable. I quite enjoyed that one. Yeah.

Jade Boycott: Just making stuff.

Lily Cleaver: And then they had like lots of like posters. I can't remember what show it was from. It was like from an old. older show and you have to recreate the kind of poster on like a big, I think it's like a meter by meter, an MDF board and they like talked you through each stage, which was actually really fun because you got to learn stuff that.

Jade Boycott: I think it showcased a lot of different skills in that one piece.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, And it was quite nice to, I was like, even if I don't get this job, like I've got to learn like how to do wood graining or like that kind of thing, which was fun. But I actually originally got rejected for the job. This is This is a story, yeah. I got when I first, because you applied online and then you kind of get those automated emails and I think it was from Creative Alliance and they were like, we don't think you can like, because I live a bit further out from like London, they were like, we don't think you can like travel for the job and commute. And I was like, wait, no, please guys, no. I can because like I'd been into London and worked into London before and I'd worked in Sidcup I travelled back and forth from Sidcart which was like 2 1/2 hours. So I was like, I had proof on my CV that I'd done it and I was like, I really want this opportunity. So I replied back, said all of that and they gave me an interview. So then now I'm here, which is quite a nice story.

Emily Slade: Yeah, that's lovely. That's so good that they were able to give you that opportunity and check with you and you could fight your case.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, you've got to fight for what you want. Yeah, I was like, not letting this go. It's too good of an opportunity. You've got to go again.

Emily Slade: So why did you choose this route over sort of university, as it were? Was that ever an option for you in your head?

Lily Cleaver: For me personally, No. if I probably would have known about Scenic Art, or that they'd done it at uni and stuff, maybe it would have been an option. But I always never really wanted to go to uni. Just because I left school, I didn't really know what I wanted to do. And I kind of like gave myself a couple of years to figure it out. And I feel like there's a lot of people in kind of creative careers, it takes a long time. Which people are always like, why are you working serving people and in hospitality and stuff? And I was like, just give me time. And then I kind of always wanted to do an apprenticeship because you're working on the job and I learn a lot better that way.

Jade Boycott: Yeah, I've actually known what I wanted to do for quite a few years, but I feel like schools don't necessarily tell you the different pathways to actually get where you want to be. I remember my teachers pushing me to go to uni and I was set up to go, it was only like the month for us to start. I thought, I just really don't want to, I was doing like a fine art course. It's like, I don't know if that's the most helpful for me because I want to do scenic art. But they're like, no, go to uni. It keeps you busy. you don't want to fall back. I thought, no, I really want to step back, take as much time as I need. Like I worked a few different jobs, just kind of thinking about what I wanted to do. And luckily I was on the mailing list here. I actually applied for a props course once here, didn't get it. But silver lining, it kind of gave me like experience of like the interview process because I got a few for a few rounds of that. And I think it really helped me with this one. And so it's just managed to get this.

Emily Slade: Yeah, definitely. So what's the goal? What's your career goals? What's the next step after this? Do you guys know?

Jade Boycott: Back to props, actually. I would really love to do some props after this because I feel like a lot of our freelancers that come in, they're all very rounded. They do a bit of scenic, a bit of prop, a bit of everything. And I'm like, I think both still really interest me. So I'd love to do a bit of that.

Lily Cleaver: Pinewood.

Jade Boycott: Pinewood.

Lily Cleaver and Jade Boycott: Pinewood.

Jade Boycott: We want to do film one day and would absolutely love to work in Pinewood. That's just, it's quite local to me. So I remember driving past as a kid thinking, oh, one day I want to be in there painting sets. But yeah, a bit of film, bit of theatre, bit of everything really. Keep it, keep a different.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, I don't think like I have a specific goal, but yeah, when like the freelancers come in, they've worked on so many different kind of shows. I'm like, oh wait, you worked on Traitors and you worked on Squid Games. I feel like I'm their biggest fangirl, but like That's what I would love to do and just be like quite well-rounded and learn props like carpentry. Like so you don't kind of minimise when you're going to like the world of freelancing.

Jade Boycott: They're so nonchalant about it.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, they're so nonchalant about it.

Jade Boycott: They're like, oh I did Harry Potter last week.

Lily Cleaver: I would not be that chill. But yeah, just kind of like, yeah, film I feel like is a big, a big one, definitely.

Emily Slade: Yeah, fantastic. So what advice would you give to anyone looking to pursue what you guys have done?

Lily Cleaver: I'd say the main thing, I'd definitely say the main thing is like constantly create stuff. It might sound a bit cliche, but literally do anything. Like I've done a few courses which definitely helped me get this job. Just kind of like showing you're like passionate, constantly like painting, I don't know, making random little crafts or like I used to like paint cards for people for like birthdays and stuff. I just took loads of pictures of them, put that in my portfolio and just like, yeah, constantly showing that you're passionate and then kind of having a good base and a portfolio. Or even volunteering, I've done a bit of volunteering for like a local theatre. Just like it doesn't have to be specifically about set, it's just that kind of industry and that kind of scene.

Jade Boycott: So I think anything you can. If it's a foot in the door, just showing enthusiasm in basically every, I only really had like school stuff I put, I put that in there. It shows from a, you know, from a young age, this is kind of your dream, what you're looking at. Yeah, pretty much just every mailing list there is, sign up to absolutely everything.

Lily Cleaver: It's a lot about, yeah, trying to find those connections. It's a lot about who you know and that kind of thing.

Jade Boycott: If you get rejected, just keep applying. If you get rejected, query it.

Emily Slade: Yeah, absolutely. And what sort of skill sets are we looking at in this field?

Jade Boycott: That's quite a hard question because I feel like we do so much different, like different things every day. Obviously, painting is It's quite important because one day you could be working on a giant beautiful cloth and the next day you'll we spent the morning trimming grass. Yeah, it's so random.

Lily Cleaver: But like if you're in a fit up for a show, you might be like painting screws black, which is just like, yeah, and then you'll be like texturing floors. And I was doing like a stained glass, like fake stained glass thing. So it's very like varied. But yeah, a lot of like, I'd say the skills, like a lot of like finishes and kind of like wood graining. bricks, marbling, that comes up a lot, and lots of plaster and texture. It's very difficult. Yeah, it's actually, people, it's so, people make it look really smooth and I'm like, I've got these trowel marks, I can't do it. It's a lot harder than it looks.

Jade Boycott: Like giant cloths, you think, God, I can't work on that, but you're after a few hours, you're like, Oh yeah, a bit back there. Yeah, But yeah, as soon as I was told, do you want to do some texturing? It's so difficult.

Lily Cleaver: And colour, I'd say actually a big one is colour mixing. You have to like batch mix like a lot of paints, like match colours to stuff, which sounds simple, but if you're doing like smaller pieces or like you do stuff at school, you just have like the kind of colours and you do it as you go along. Like mixing one big colour, I'm like, Oh my God, why is it not right? Why is it too yellow? It's that kind of thing.

Emily Slade: Yeah, fantastic. And then I suppose in terms of soft skills, when you're in the workshop working on the different projects, what do you guys have to be like organised? Do you have to communicate well? Is there anything in that area that you guys can think of top of your head that you feel like you're constantly doing? Or is it more like Sorry, is it more like, I guess, do you have to really listen and follow instructions and that sort of thing?

Jade Boycott: So very much a team effort. Everything, a lot of communication. If you're moving something large, obviously you don't want anyone to get injured, so you have to be listening out for what everyone else is doing.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, you have to be quite self-aware, even if you're just like sat at like a desk, like doing your own little thing. You have to be aware of like kind of what's around you or someone needs help. Yeah, communication, teamwork. Yeah, I would. I feel like they're the main kind of ones.

Emily Slade: Perfect. What's been your favourite thing so far?

Lily Cleaver: Okay, two things. Can I say two things? So I say going to RADA, having that kind of opportunity, being around like... younger people, which is quite nice, getting that kind of taste of uni life, getting paid for it, which is good. And I'd say we got to work on the Hamlet cloth, which is like a massive, was it 30 metres?

Jade Boycott: Yeah, or something like that.

Lily Cleaver: That was huge. Like 30 metres, Renaissance kind of style cloth. That was back in August. So we both started in April, May time. So we were only like a few months in, but we got the chance to literally like work on that from beginning to end. and kind of, I hate drawing faces. I always have. Now I don't. Now I'm not as scared anymore. I still don't really like it.

Jade Boycott: After you've sketched like 40 of them, it's like yeah yeah, just another portrait. You start to lose track.

Lily Cleaver: But kind of learning that kind of skill of kind of letting go of that, kind of being hyper-focused or like super perfectionist and learning like actually you can put a few like little brush strokes and values and kind of highlights and you step down, it looks like a face or it looks like a horse or something like that. It's that kind of So, they were probably.

Jade Boycott: It's when you step away and it doesn't.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, But it's, you kind of, it was nice to learn. It was nice to learn that to be like, oh, actually I don't have to be super detailed and I can, I don't know, I feel like you don't really think of it.

Jade Boycott: I don't think of it in that way.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jade Boycott: I don't know if this is kind of skirting the question a bit, but I'm going to say just the like daily routine of it. Everything is so different. One day you come in and you're trimming grass and And then you have to go run over to stage and help out whatever they need there. And it's not like the same monotonous routine. It's always different because every show is different. Yeah, I kind of like that.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, it's nice to not be that. I don't think I could sit at a desk and...

Jade Boycott: No, no no

Lily Cleaver: No

Emily Slade: Yeah. Was there anything else that you guys can think of off the top of your heads that I haven't mentioned that you feel would be worth mentioning at all?

Jade Boycott: You think it's going to be, oh, I'm going to come away looking all painterly today and all cute? It's not a very aesthetic job. No, you look terrible at the end of every day.

Lily Cleaver: Yeah, it's very, very messy. They said that like in the interview, they're like, you're prepared to be messy like on your feet all day, which you are on your feet like all day a lot. Wearing steelies as well, they can be quite, they can be quite heavy.

Emily Slade: What do you mean steel toe capped boots?

Lily Cleaver: Yeah steel toe caps Yeah, sorry.

Emily Slade: You've got the lingo

Lily Cleaver and Jade Boycott: (Laughing)

Lily Cleaver: You can tell we work here now. It's like we're scenic artists. Yeah, I know, but like actually, I don't know if you like think of like an artist and they're all cute and you know, they've got their dungarees on No, you're like covered in like horrible texture and like it's never like cute colours. It's always like brown.

Jade Boycott: Brown all over your legs.

Lily Cleaver: And you go home on the train, you're like, please, people are going to think I'm so dirty.

Jade Boycott: Yeah, it gets all under your nails. It's all under my nails right now. I'm gonna stop looking at that.

Emily Slade: It's not glamorous, but do you then get to see your finished works up on stage under the light?

Lily Cleaver: Yeah. Or like watching, I think one of the first things we've done was a show called The Estate, which was in the Dorfman. And we got to like, well, we worked on like creating the whole, it was like a big like mansion, was it?

Jade Boycott: Yeah.

Lily Cleaver: And we got to do like the texturing for that. But we also got to do like, there was two big abstract paintings in the in the kind of bedroom or living room or whatever it was. And we got to make those. And I remember us were like watching the dress rehearsal and the kind of like set open and our two like massive paintings were on the back. And they were like properly lit. Yeah, And it was like, wow, like that's my work on the stage. This is really, really cool. It's just nice to, it's nice to have that. It makes you feel like proud of yourself.

Jade Boycott: Yeah.

Lily Cleaver: Fantastic.

Emily Slade: That's brilliant. Thank you guys so much for your time today.

Lily Cleaver and Jade Boycott: Thank you so much.

Simon Stephens: My name is Simon Stephens. I'm head of the Skills Centre at the National Theatre.

Emily Slade: Perfect. And what is the Skills Centre at the National Theatre?

Simon Stephens: The Skills Centre is part of the learning department and our key initiative is to address skills gaps in the theatre sector and in the wider creative industry. And we're doing that in partnership with Bank of America and the areas of the industry that we're most focused on are design, craft, technical and production roles. And as we address those skills gaps, we're also trying to make sure that we make the workforce much more representative than it is currently in those areas.

Emily Slade: What skills gaps are we talking about? Can you tell us a bit about the sector at large?

Simon Stephens: Yeah, so we're prioritising in the first instance design, craft, technical and production roles. So there's various reasons why there are gaps in those areas of the industry. Some of it is COVID. The creative sector, large parts of our workforce are freelancers. And so obviously COVID was incredibly challenging. Some people decided to retrain and move into different sectors. the screen sector came back much more quickly than live performance for obvious reasons. And so the people that have transferable skills in things like scenic construction or wigs, hair and makeup or costume were able to find work in the screen sector. And so some people have continued to work in that area. And then over the last probably 14, 15 years or so, there's been a slowdown in young people coming into the sector. Because of the sort of reduction in arts provision in schools, it has had a knock-on effect in terms of who might be thinking about a career in the theatre. So that's something that we've been working to address, and not just the National Theatre, but the wider sector to address that sort of reduction in focus on creative careers and the reduction of arts provision in schools means that, it's just not on your radar. And there has been, there was a much greater focus on sort of core curriculum subjects, on STEM subjects, which I think understandably for young people, for parents, for their carers, it feels like pursuing one of those routes as a career or as training might be a sort of more secure or stable opportunity.

Emily Slade: Yeah, so I suppose what does the skill centre offer in terms of how is it actively working towards those goals?

Simon Stephens: Yeah, so we're working to address the skills gaps in several ways. So some of it is about signposting young people into creative careers that they don't know about. So making sure that we demystify all of the roles that take place across the theatre, across the creative sector that you just wouldn't hear about because you know you don't know what you don't know, you can't be what you can't see. And The National Theatre is the biggest factory in central London. So everything that appears on our stages is made in this building. So whether you're somebody who's really creative with your hands, you're, you know, we have carpenters, we have scenic artists, we have costume makers, but also we have really skilled people in digital design, in filmmaking, marketers, people in finance, people in press. So there is a job for everyone in the sector. The National Theatre obviously has a huge workforce, but that is replicated in different scales across the rest of the industry. So whether it's a smaller theatre in London or somewhere around the UK or in the West End, it's a really rich ecology with lots of opportunity and lots of really interesting diverse jobs that ask for lots of different skills.

Emily Slade: And is that something that a career path that anyone can take at any point in their life?

Simon Stephens: Yeah, I think so. I mentioned obviously demystifying those roles for young people, but then there's got to be the sort of practical stepping stones into those careers. So we offer in-person training opportunities and courses, which some of those are for people sort of 14 to 18, some of them are for people 19 plus. But there are really tangible ways to bring people in. So we have an amazing apprenticeship programme. So we've had over 60 apprentices over the last 10 plus years in all areas of the organisation. And apprenticeships have been really transformative in changing who is in our workforce, because you are earning and learning at the same time. So people don't have the same concerns about acquiring lots of debt that is an issue for people, particularly if you're from a lower socioeconomic background and higher education might not seem achievable and it might feel financially alienating. So that's why apprenticeships have been amazing. And everywhere from the fundraising and development department to IT, to scenic art, to carpentry, metalwork, technical theatre, we've had apprentices in all of those areas. And then other ways to bring people into the workforce at different points. So it's not restricted by age. We're really interested in going, if you are looking to pivot your career as an adult, you're workforce ready because you're at the right age, what are the things that we can do to help bring people in? So we've run short courses which will introduce people to a particular skill. So we've done one in prop making, which was focused on sort of paint finishes and was a way of people who might have some of those skills to think about how they could go further or what the next steps would be. We have paid production placements. So one, at least one on every production. And those vary from people who are perhaps right at the beginning of their creative journey and want to find out more about a particular discipline or a particular role, through to people who bring a little bit more experience and want to actually develop their skills, gain a greater insight into the production process at the National Theatre. So in the last few months we've had somebody working in the choreography department on our production of The Bacchae, we've had people who have shadowed our fight directors on Hamlet, in the props department. We're currently recruiting someone to work with a composer on an upcoming production, someone to work with the lighting designer. So those opportunities are paid, paid at London Living Wage to ensure that there is no financial barrier to people taking part in that opportunity.

Emily Slade: And is the sort of entry requirement, just a passion and an interest.

Simon Stephens: Slightly different for each one, depending on what the artist who is hosting that placement feels would make the most impact. We're really keen to go, how can we make the most impact for the individual based on their experience? So if it's quite entry level or very sort of early in their discovery process, what's appropriate for them? if somebody has got some experience from other productions, from other training, what can we do to help them take that up the sort of the next level? So it's very bespoke. We're trying to meet people where they are at as opposed to us setting all of the parameters of what we want to achieve.

Emily Slade: Yeah, perfect. What's the most exciting thing?

Simon Stephens: About the skill centre? I think What is really exciting is providing an opportunity for people to get really up close to the amazing artists, crafts people, technicians that work in this building and in the spaces that they are making that work. You know, the people who make the work in this building are are really exceptional. I've mentioned already the scenic artists, but the carpenters, the crew, the technicians, the stage management teams, they are incredibly skilful. And you can really see it make an impact on somebody when they're in a workshop, in a Q&A, in a training session with those people, because they are getting absolute sort of, you know, gold dust insights into what the National Theatre do into those career paths. And that is absolutely thrilling. I never get tired of being sat at the back of a workshop and seeing, a group of young people all with their hands in the air, wanting to ask a question of the stage manager or the lighting technician or the sound supervisor, whoever it might be. And that feels also really transformative. It can be that moment, I think, where that spark of imagination is really ignited for a young person to go, I want to do what that person does because It seems so varied, so exciting, so creative.

Emily Slade: And if people are interested in these opportunities, what would you suggest? What's the next step for them to find them out?

Simon Stephens: Yeah, so... Every course, initiative, opportunity that we have is on the National Theatres website somewhere, but the best thing to do is to sign up for the learning mailing list if you find that via the National Theatres website. And then when those opportunities come up, they will be sent out to people on the mailing list and you can tick the things that you're sort of most interested in because as well as the skills work, we have a team who are creating work for young people, who are creating work for schools. So across the learning department, we collaborate significantly together, but you can sort of opt into the things that would be most useful to you.

Emily Slade: So November marks Discover Creative Careers Month. Can you tell us a bit about that?

Simon Stephens: Yes, Discover Creative Careers Month is an initiative supported by the DCMS, which is brilliant to have government funding focused on careers in the creative sector. And The National Theatre, alongside loads of other employers and organisations across the country, are providing opportunities to signpost young people into the wealth of creative careers that are out there. So across the month, we've been releasing some digital content, which gives some sort of day in the life insight into some of the roles in our organisation. We've got four local schools who will be joining us at the end of the month for a creative choices day where they'll do a practical hands-on workshop and then they'll also have the opportunity to do one of our careers in action tours. So those tours really take you around the building and point out who is doing what in each area of the organisation. But it's just a great opportunity to amplify and really demystify all of the roles that exist in this part of our industry.

Emily Slade: Yeah, fantastic. Why should people pursue a role in the arts? Why is it important?

Simon Stephens: I think having a sort of, you know, rich cultural life is really important for any society, I really passionately believe in the transformative power of theatre, both the art that we see, but also what it means to be part of that workforce. But I think for somebody starting out on their career, the theatre industry is so collaborative, it's so varied, it's driven by the productions and the shows that we make. So daily work life is different every day. you might be in the process of, setting up a production in its really early doors. You might have the opportunity to work on a show that's got a long run and have your eyes on what is coming next. So whether you're the person creating all of the, graphics and the marketing materials or whether you are creating the costumes for that show, there's such a huge amount of variety. And I think the essential skills that you acquire of collaboration, of communication are huge and really transferable into other industries, into other sectors, I think. And so I think it's just a really rich, full career choice. And I think if you are creative, and whatever that creativity is, whether it might be digital, or whether it might be very tangible, and the sort of creativity that you do with your hands and eyes, there is an opportunity for you to develop that in the theatre sector.

Emily Slade: Yeah, fantastic. Was there anything else that you wanted to mention?

Simon Stephens: We have three, so if people are interested, there are all sorts of things that you can sign up for. and it's worth always checking the National Theatre website, but we're recruiting for a few different opportunities at the moment. We have an introduction to stage design, which is for people 16 to 19 interested in set and costume design. We have a How to Be a Producer course, which is an intensive week, which happens early in 2026, but applications are open at the moment. And also if you're outside of London, we run a nationwide Young Techs course, that's for young people 14 to 18 and that's sort of like a live lesson beamed out from the National Theatre to young people in their homes on Zoom every week. So again, open for recruitment at the moment.

Emily Slade: Amazing. That's brilliant. Thank you so much for your time today.

Simon Stephens: Thank you. Thank you so much.

Emily Slade: Thanks again to Simon, Jade and Lily for their time. For more information on getting into the arts or pursuing an apprenticeship, you can head to prospects.ac.uk where you can sign up for job and course alerts for free. You can also head to our YouTube channel at Future You Pod to watch both interviews. And if you enjoyed the episode, we'd love to hear from you. can contact us at podcast at prospects.ac.uk or you can leave us a review on Apple or Spotify. Thank you as always for listening and good luck on your journey to Future You.

Notes on transcript

This transcript was produced using a combination of automated software and human transcribers and may contain errors. The audio version is definitive and should be checked before quoting.

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